Ok. I'm trying to gather all the ideas and thoughts.

LG's proposition about zip patches sounds interesting. This could be a quick way for the community to make and share patches. I see this like some special DOC with the list of patches, instructions, changelogs and attached packages. Only a few members could have access to that DOC. Those patches could also be cumulative. But. Most of the community is not reading the forums, they just go to the download page and check for a new version. So maybe there could be a link to a doc with patches on the download page. But that starts to sound too awkward. Though, still such an idea of having quick hotfixes is interesting. And those patches later could be incorporated into a normal releases.

LG, can you comment more on "Another option would be to automate the "build EXE installer" task so it can run nightly. Similar to the nightly builds."? Are you speaking about Jive building it with install4j nightly or we will have to use some other system?

As about polishing and maintaining the site. Gato said that they have a man who is maintaining all their sites. I think he didnt understand the whole question. He was speaking about their web admin probably. Web admin cant update the outdated content or polish the site.. This part lacks understanding from Jive i think. I dont mind it to be done by Jive.

Both Daryl and LG mentioned QA. So maybe we should form a QA team and Jive should wait for this team approval before releasing something? I wonder will it help much? I'm sure they have their own QA and as they say "doing many tests on more than one server". Personally i havent had any significant upgrade problems for a long time. On the other hand others do have problems. So we can still miss something and the release will be delayed longer. Hard to decide. Sure, we need some QA instructions to do that, cause now i can only check if it launches after the upgrade and can i send the messages. Probably i can volunteer for some QA (windows exe and linux tar.gz), but i need to know what should i be doing.

Testing of the patches by community. This can be some sort of QA. Contributor releases patches. Our QA team tests it and then approves that everything is working correctly. Then Jive incorporates these patches. Gato was speaking about some "crucible" addition to a svn/fisheye which will let to review patches after the submittion, if i understand right. If this really can help, we should "push" Jive to implement this in their system.

And the last and very important thing. The lack of response. I bet noone from Jive is reading this Maybe their are not watching Jira closely either. As well as the forums. I can understand that this is a large amount of information to monitor/test/answer etc. This version of Clearspace lets us to create social groups. What about creating some small closed contributors group. Also someone from Jive should be a member of that group, and not just formally. He will have to check that group's discussion and submission on a regular basis. Maybe we should have a separate chat session for that group. Then such a group will gather all the most important reports, patches and relay it to a Jive guy. The traffic should be smaller, more concentrated and detailed. This is just an idea. This won't work without Jive bigger involvement than now. We need a strong link with them (preferable Gato or Matt).

I think donations should go to LG, as he is so actively pushing this idea Personally i dont see how this can help. People will donate to Jive i think, but they will be willing to get some feedback in quick releases and bug fixes. I dont think this will motivate Jive a lot. And i dont think people will be willing to donate on an account of some unknown to them community contributors..